irish league crowds

[TANGERINE]

can anyone give me any info on what kind of attendances the irish league gets ?. im particularly interested in glentoran not just for a linfield game but an average league gate at the oval .

[Dino-the-Cat]

Unlike the English Leagues, the Irish League does not publish attendance figures as they like to avoid the attention of the Inland Revenue. A recent survey suggested that Linfield attract about 3000, Glentoran less than 2000 and the average of the other Clubs is just over 500. Omagh are lucky to get 200. In the 1st. Division, the average would be about 150 while the "bigger" clubs like Bangor, Distillery and Ballymena woul hope to attract about 250 when they play each other. Can anyone out there verify these figures ?

[K@mpso]

You're probably not too far off Dino, I'd have thought a wee bit higher just.

What gets me is that when there is clearly a near capacity crowd at the big two games, the attendance released to the media is often ridiculously low.

[Dean]

What was this survey Dino??? I would love to know what the gates for certain games are??

[Dino-the-Cat]

Hoggy - the survey appeared in the Belfast Telegraph I think and was also quoted on TV in a programme about the success of the Belfast Giants ice hockey team. What is the official reason why Irish League crowds are not published. We all know the real reason. And how do the paying punters know that all the money collected at the gate goes to the club? And how do the punters know how the money is actually spent? I usually try to count the crowd - it's not too difficult in the 1st Division!

[Dean]

You would be right about the Glens home gate around 2-2500 at a normal match when we arnt doing shite ie getting beat by Omagh town at home. <IMG SRC="smilies/cry.gif" border="0"> . Ive never been to a Linfield vs any other team so I don't know but the way the bluemen get on youd be thinking they get a crowd of 5000 every match????

As for the other premier teams I reckon they get more then 1000 although again Ive only seen them when they are playing the Glens. As for the First Division it wouldnt be that bad would it? Being able to count them? I thought Bangor were one of the Bigger supported clubs.

[ourkid]

Well Linfields saturday attendance, i would judge on how filled each stand is. usually the kop is about 1/3-1/2 full and the South stand is around 2/3 full, and that is for games like LFC v Omagh or somethin mundane like that, usually crowds increase by about 1/3 v the more challenging teams like Mid Ulster and Coleraine, and usually both stands are full on saturday big two derbies, with the exception of a small section in the kop.

So to put figures to that.. 1/3 Kop - 1300, 2/3 South Stand - 2500, so the blues usually get around 4,000.

Personally i think the home gates are understated for tax scams, i dont think a single blueman trusts their secretary Derek Brooks, who has always been up to dodgy dealings.

[EireBadBoy]

It is interesting the way we never see any Official's of any Leagues voicing comments on Message Boards such as this (buck, there are'nt many Irish League Message Boards about!) trying to give us any answers or explanations. Surely you have to be joking about these Tax dodgy comments! If not I might mention it to the Derry Board! <IMG SRC="smilies/frog.gif" border="0">

[Dean]

Well Ourkid that 4000 was halved against the biggest team in the world. And don't forget there would have been alot of United supporters and neutrals there aswell. <IMG SRC="smilies/redface2.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/redface2.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/redface2.gif" border="0">

[main man]

talk about linfield tax exploits i rem a germany vs n.ireland game at winger park and the ground was full and only a couple seats around the ground were unused i really do wonder y the attendance was 3 or 4 thousand less than a full capacity mmmmmmm i wondered were linfield ever managed to get there money for that new stand a few years back <IMG SRC="smilies/bomb.gif" border="0">

[Owen]

Linfield gain money from the IFA

1.dishonesty

2.thieving

3.racketeering

4.extortion

5.cheatery

6.terrorism

glad to have cleared that up.

[brandywellpride89]

Brave man Sky blue slagging the two biggest clubs in the six counties on this forum!

See other post from wankbrick elsewhere

[ 23 August 2001: Message edited by: Brandywellpride89 ]

[brandywellpride89]

Holy sh1t!

I just read the posts further up this board and "Ballymena gets around 350 at a game"

So you's are a big club are ye hi sir? <IMG SRC="smilies/smokin.gif" border="0">

Oh my god!Even worse 250!
And you slagged Derry for only having 3500 for Real Madrids 2nd team.
And remember we had 10,000 against Celtic and 9,500 against Manu last season!

[ 23 August 2001: Message edited by: Brandywellpride89 ]

[houndguy]

<IMG SRC="smilies/confused.gif" border="0"> I know virtually nothing about the Irish game, but are these real figures or am I missing a zero somewhere? These numbers are comparable to what were getting at an MLS game!!!

Please tell me Irish football is not as bad as that!

[Daz]

It is mate. Don't forget Irish League (NI) football is amateur ie the vast majority of players have a full time job.

[Dean]

Brave man Sky blue slagging the two biggest clubs in the six counties on this forum!

Sky Blue hasn't slagged off Glentoran or Dundela has he??? <IMG SRC="smilies/tongue2.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/tongue2.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/tongue2.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/tongue2.gif" border="0"> <IMG SRC="smilies/tongue2.gif" border="0">

[alanglentoran]

Thursday night saw around 5000 turn up at the Oval, pay a tenner, see a team that no one outside Herning and Ikast has ever heard of (bet yer all saying "where?" - see, I was right, wasn't I?), and be let down. This was the opportunity to attract some supporters back (I didn't recognise anyone in the shed - but then I only used to see backs of heads) but the Glens probably managed to drive a lot away they were so poor. BTW, there was a group of about 20 Japanese kids at the game, I'm sure they are all Midgetland supporters now!

Anyway, the point is, 5000 (minus 4 Danes) to see the Glens. Where are they the rest of the year! The crowds are there but how do we bring them out?

[houndguy]

Ok, I'm curious. 5000 is the ave attendence at an A-league (US 2nd division) match. What are the clubs doing to increase attendence? What are the fans doing to increase attendence?

We have something called the Southern Derby between 3 clubs. It was set up by the fan clubs to promote the game in these cities (to learn more go to www.a-league.com (http://www.a-league.com) and click on Southern Derby). An offshot of this is the Brimstone Cup between the Chicago Fire and Dallas Burn of MLS. Both have generated media interest and that in turn, increased attendence.

Could something like that work here? Or am I blowing smoke out my a**?

[ourkid]

erm...

Linfield gain money from the IFA
1.dishonesty

2.thieving

3.racketeering

4.extortion

5.cheatery

6.terrorism

glad to have


explain that to me plz would you???

Linfield gain money from the IFA because the IFA could not afford to build their own national stadium, instead they were too busy building the wallets of their own representatives, so instead they hired Windsor Park off the blues, and provided funding for some of the facilities. Camera crews film matches at NI, park their stuff at Windsor, therefore Linfield were smart enough to capitalize on this and demand premiums for each match. Its simply jealousy from other teams that make them say, linfield gets this, linfield gets that.
Its simply the fact that Linfield had unrivalled sucess (with challenges coming from Glentoran, Derry City and the only real almost equal challenge coming from Belfast Celtic), especially in the 50's and their pinnacle in 1961-62. They were receiving attendances ranging from 40-50'000 which can be confirmed by historians. Even some other clubs like ards, Glentoran and Cliftonville were getting 30k plus crowds.
With all this support coming into the blues, they build stands over the years, mainly the old Gallaghers stand, railway stand and the South stand, that was in the sixties! Glentoran apparently the number two club of NI, still do not have two stands! Linfield also put money into the ground facilities, and some local residents turned an old bog pit out the back into a grass pitch which was then adopted as a training pitch and reserves pitch, Midgely Park (which would give some amateur grounds a run for their money!). All this happened 40 years ago, without the help of the IFA and all because at that time, Linfield put their money into their stadium and not their executive wallets. The natural choice was to choose the best ground in NI as the national teams ground, if they were not gonna build a new one. In that agreement, Linfield made a proper business agreement and made sure they could get what they could out of it.

To the bystander who cant understand why NI teams got between 30-50'000 supporters in the past and 300-5000 in present day, well look at the attendances for the Irish cup final between 65-75. These are estimates but your talking like 65-68 avg 25k, and the next few years they drop to around 5k-8k which just so happens is the same years the trouble started in NI, which i believe killed the local game.

If your gonna post accusations about a club, of course you have the proof to back it up?

[Dino-the-Cat]

Was at the Bangor v. Distillery match last Saturday. These two clubs are supposed to be the top teams in the Division, with Ballymena, yet i reckon there was just short of 250 spectators at the match. The way bangor played, they will be lucky to make 150 at the next home match !

[Owen]

Our Kid. Mmm. You might want to see an above posting Sky Blue made about tongues and cheeks (I really am going to have to change my name so we stop getting confused). The allegations were lubricated by a substantial amount of lager and I'm guessing my gist was the unfair advantages Linfield enjoy from the IFA/Linfield (eg.for years an extra home game just because they have so many supporters who can't behave themselves).

[ourkid]

lol... Linfield home fans? these the same ones when they went back to solitude, been there for quite a few matches now, without a single incident of trouble from them? Yet get pelted by missiles on the Cliftonville Road?
Stop making silly half-baked comments. For 15 years, Cliftonville matches at Windsor when the old Kop was there, saw the redmen have running battle fights with the RUC, throw stones towards the North Stand and South Stand, and wreak havoc in the local area, running through the Olympia area and smashing windows and cars. This I dont blame on Cliftonville F.C. support, but sad hangers on who are there to cause trouble and nothing else, and yes, over that 15 years, Linfield so called fans threw stones, and even a paramilitary organisation threw a grenade at them! As it stands, both clubs had a shit element and because of the threat of trouble of both bluemen to the surrounding area, and the local population v bluemen (as we seen recently), the match was banned, Grow up Ballymenahey, and get facts straight, or post when sober.

[quietman]

Surely the issue is not the numbers, but how we can get more to the games.

Start with UTV / BBC NI...why do we have around 3 hours of GAA coverage and about 15 minutes of Irish League coverage per week?To make the game more credible, we need to raise its profile in the media.

What about the fixture gimps? Trying to get casual punters away from Man U vs Real or Liverpool vs Roma is not going to work. We have to stagger the games away from live TV clashes. Thursday nights might work better on Champions League weeks.

The big one is - those pricks that just slag the local game as being s**te. Course it is when pricks like them dont give it some support. Its those guys we need to attract to the grounds. But how?

We all know blokes that spend £200 and 36 hour round trip to go to Ibrox / OT / Anfield. It cant be just for the quality of football (you can see that on TV), so it must be for the atmosphere, and I reckon that is where we should concentrate. It is possible - witness Big2 games, Cup Finals, Promotion PlayOffs, Derbies etc. We should try and get some atmosphere into every game for a start. Thats not down to anyone but us.

[houndguy]

I'm still curious on what, if anything, the clubs and their fans are doing to increase attendence.

I'm a huge supporter of 2nd division football here in the states. The ave crowd for a 2nd divisison game probably is about 5000. Supporters of various clubs have tried to generate interest through a variety of means, including creating their own Cup competions. In the USL it is the Southern Derby (http://www.a-league.com/Southern_Derby/2001/) , in MLS it's the Brimstone Cup. This was started by the fans of the Chicago Fire (http://www.barnburners.com) and the Dallas Burn (http://www.3rddegree.net).

Would any Irish Club be interested in playing friendlies against a professional US side? I may be able to arrange something.

[Daz]

A friendly against a US side? That'd be a laugh Rob! To my knowledge no Irish league club has ever played an American team, they'd probably hammer us. How involved are you that you may be able to set up a friendly? I'm sure the IFA would love to hear from you.

[colerainefc]

Well, that would be intertesting. This has nothing to do with the debate but in the summer, there was a touring American under 16 team NYC Counties side in Northern Ireland. The team I play for - Coleraine Swifts managed to get a game arranaged with them, they beat us 4-1. We gave them a good game but in the end their fitness beat us not their skill.

[alanglentoran]

The Glens played two US teams in Florida in 1986 I think it was Fort Lauderdale and another), drew one and won one. They also played QPR as Tampa Bay Rowdies and lost 1-0 (when QPR where good!).

As I'm sure you all know we also competed as the Detroit Cougars in 1967 versus teams such as Sunderland, Wolves, Hibs, Bangu and Cerro masquarading as American cities.

BTW, the Glens' season tickets have passed the 1,000 mark this year for the first time in recent memory. (according to the club)

[houndguy]

Originally posted by Daz
A friendly against a US side? That'd be a laugh Rob! To my knowledge no Irish league club has ever played an American team, they'd probably hammer us. How involved are you that you may be able to set up a friendly? I'm sure the IFA would love to hear from you.

Daz, send me an e-mail with the needed info about the IFA and I'll see what I can do. Can't promise much, my influence is small, but at least I'll put a bug into someone's ear.

[DrownedRaccoon]

a friendly being organised on this! if i see the ifa start exploring opportunties to play american teams, i'll know who's responsible.:D

[ourkid]

was asked Linfield season ticket sales somewhere...

They avg out around 1500-2200 over the past 10 seasons

[houndguy]

:cool: Just to let everyone know, their are about four of us right now trying to make this happen. It can and will if I have anything to say about it. We have something here in the US called the Southern Derby, which is a fan sponsered and run Cup competition. It is now entering its 3rd year.

If we pool our resources the first ever fan sponsered and run international friendly may become a possiblility.

If you want to help then either contact Daz or myself (robert.wilson@a-league.com).

[Picachu]

Crowds in Ireland seem far better than in the League of Wales. Bangor City have until recently been the best supported and will be again with success, but they are hard pushed getting 1000+. Some teams only get 150+, whilst Barry Town a full time team only average 350+. People wonder why I stopped watching Bangor City this is one reason.:frog: