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red army
18th October 2001, 15:27
Thursday, 18 October, 2001, 08:44 GMT 09:44 UK
Woman loses right-to-die case

A terminally-ill woman has lost a High Court challenge to laws which prevent her husband helping her to die.
However, Diane Pretty, who is dying from motor neurone disease, will now take the case directly to the House of Lords.

Motor neurone disease is an incurable and progressive illness which is gradually taking away Mrs Pretty's ability to move and communicate with others.

She wants to commit suicide, but would need assistance to do so.

She claims her quality of life has become so low that denying her the opportunity to commit suicide is a breach of her human rights.



Diane and Brian Pretty

In the first case of its kind, Mrs Pretty challenged a refusal by the Director of Public Prosecutions, David Calvert-Smith, to rule out taking action against her husband of 25 years, Brian, if he helps her commit suicide.

However, on Thursday morning, the panel of three High Court judges, while saying they felt "desperately sorry" for the couple, ruled that no-one had the human right to "procure their own death".

Had the Director of Public Prosecutions agreed not to prosecute her husband, it would be a "licence to commit crime", they said.

Dignity

The right to human dignity enshrined in the new Act was not the right to die with dignity, they ruled - simply the right to enjoy as dignified a life as possible.

Lord Justice Tuckey, one of the three, said: "Even if we had good reason to think that the blanket ban on assisting suicide were no longer thought necessary in the democratic society of England and Wales, we would have no reason to think that to allow assisted suicide in such circumstances would be generally acceptable."



Diane has said she wants to carry on. She's a very tough lady and always knows exactly what she wants

Deborah Annetts, Voluntary Euthanasia Society

Mr Pretty could face a 14-year jail sentence if convicted of assisting a suicide.

Outside the court after the ruling, Mrs Pretty said that she was "angry and disappointed".

Her husband confirmed that she would be taking the case directly to the House of Lords.

Fighting on

Deborah Annetts from the Voluntary Euthanasia Society told the BBC that there were good grounds for carrying on the fight.

"Diane has said she wants to carry on. She's a very tough lady and always knows exactly what she wants.



I think it is a victory for common sense

Dr Michael Howitt-Wilson, Alert
"She wants to die with dignity, when and how she wants."

A spokesman for Liberty, the civil rights organisation, said: "We are very disappointed but we will look forward to taking the case to the House of Lords."

Mona Arshi, Diane Pretty's solicitor, told the BBC: "We will be arguing that this court just didn't get the law right."

However, the ruling was immediately welcomed by some campaigners.

Dr Greg Gardner, deputy chairman of the Medical Ethics Alliance said: "What we were looking at was not the autonomy of one person to have assisted suicide, but the freedom of the majority to be protected from value judgements about the quality of life."

Dr Michael Howitt-Wilson, deputy chairman of pressure group Alert, said: "I think it is a victory for common sense."

The judges said that their decision was "inescapable", and refused her leave to make an appeal.

However, she can take the case directly to the Law Lords.

Disease advanced

During the two day hearing last week Philip Havers QC, representing Ms Pretty, told the three judges that her disease was at an advanced stage.



She very strongly wishes to control when and where she dies

Philip Havers QC, for Diane Pretty
He told the court: "She is frightened and distressed at the suffering and indignity which she will have to endure before she dies if the disease is allowed to run its course.

"She very strongly wishes to control when and where she dies."

After the case, the Crown Prosecution Service said it was sympathetic to Mrs Pretty's circumstances, but welcomed the ruling.

"The Director of Public Prosecutions cannot licence people to commit crimes," a spokesman said.

Swansea Til I die
18th October 2001, 23:07
i think thats disgusting. who the **** are teh government 2 tell us when and where we cant die?

Infidel
18th October 2001, 23:13
That's just the start.

World Trade Centre attacks = death of civil rights.

Elan_da_Scooby_Sheep
18th October 2001, 23:35
No - Destruction of WTC = The Death of 5,000 people.

It also signalled the starting of people whinging about why the government didn't do more to prevent it happening, and then even more whinging when they do. :mad:

Infidel
18th October 2001, 23:44
So you think that the implementation of Big Brother state by stealth is the right way to go about things?

I thought we were protecting 'the free world'...

Elan_da_Scooby_Sheep
19th October 2001, 00:00
If the "implemntation of of Big Brother state by stealth" as you put it, is able to, in any degree, help prevent incidents such as those that occured in America happenening again, or anything else like it, then yes I'm in favour.
I'm afraid theres no such thing as a free world anymore, and it's a fact of life that governments will, and do routinely monitor joe public. Like it or not it happening right now and will continue to do so, probably to a much greater degree within the next few years. It's such monitoring that has prevented previous terrorist and criminal acts from occuring, and to be honest if peoples lives are going to be saved at the expense of maybe a few people in whitehall knowing who I called once on the 12th of November 2000, or what my shopping habits are, then I really don't care. It's the governments duty to protect it's citizens and If you've got nothing to hide, then why worry?

I'm just grateful I'm privaleged to live in a country such as England, rather than in some third world dictatorship, as should you. Believe me Big brother could be a lot worse.

Infidel
19th October 2001, 00:05
Will reply when not asleep. :)

Hazza
19th October 2001, 00:26
Diane Pretty is paralized from the neck down because of this illness. She will soon start losing the ability to communicate with people. There is no cure for her.

What kind of life is she going to have? What kind of life is her husband going to have?

If she wants to end it all to stop her suffering, then let her. Nobody should have the right to stop her doing what her heart is telling her to do. She is old enough, and wise enough to make the choice, the decision on whether she wants to carry on living and deteriating, or getting out of her living hell. All she wants is a bit of dignity, nothing else.

Put yourselves in her situation, would you be able to cope?

The courts were wrong imo about sentencing her husband should he help her end her misery.

SID
19th October 2001, 03:10
IT'S A TOUCHY SUBJECT TOO SOME PEOPLE BUT ALL I WANT IS TOO DIE WITH SOME DIGNITY!! ...IF I WAS IN THAT SITUATION I WOULD NOT LIKE TOO SUFFER!! BUT FOR THOSE WHO ARE TERMINELY ILL AND DON'T WANT TO SUFFER THEY SHOULD HAVE THE RIGHT TOO END THEIR LIVES AS THEY SEE FIT.

MY GRAN WAS DIAGNOSED WITH HAVING SEVERE DEPRESSION AND SHECOMMITTED SUICIDE BY JUMPING OUT OF A WINDOW, I NOW THAT THIS IS NOT THE SAME SITUATION AS DIANE PRETTY BUT I MISS MY GRAN DEEPLY AND I DID'NT LIKE TOO SEE HER SUFFER!! THIS HAPPENED ABOUT 19 YEAR'S AGO AND I'M LEARNING TOO COPE WITH THIS AS TIME GOES BY. MY FATHER WAS AN AMBLENCE DRIVER AT THE TIME AND HE WAS CALLED TOO THE SCENE ...I'LL NEVER FORGET THE EXPRESSION ON HIS FACE WHEN HE CAME HOME. I LOOK BACK AT THE EVENT'S ON THAT DAY WITH GREAT SADNESS AND I NOW HAVE COME TOO TERM'S WITH THE FACT THIS IS WHAT MY GRAN WANTED TOO MAKE HER HAPPY!!

I MISS YOU GRAN

Infidel
19th October 2001, 10:18
Bloody hell SID...

The problem with Euthanasia is that not all cases are as 'clean-cut' as the those outlined above, and once a precendent has been set...


E_D_S_S

"If the "implemntation of of Big Brother state by stealth" as you put it, is able to, in any degree, help prevent incidents such as those that occured in America happenening again, or anything else like it, then yes I'm in favour.
I'm afraid theres no such thing as a free world anymore, and it's a fact of life that governments will, and do routinely monitor joe public. Like it or not it happening right now and will continue to do so, probably to a much greater degree within the next few years. It's such monitoring that has prevented previous terrorist and criminal acts from occuring, and to be honest if peoples lives are going to be saved at the expense of maybe a few people in whitehall knowing who I called once on the 12th of November 2000, or what my shopping habits are, then I really don't care. It's the governments duty to protect it's citizens and If you've got nothing to hide, then why worry?

I'm just grateful I'm privaleged to live in a country such as England, rather than in some third world dictatorship, as should you. Believe me Big brother could be a lot worse."

So essentially you're saying that just becuase Tony Blair isn't Pol Pot you're perfectly satisfied? Obviously we're a lot better off than folks in some other countries but it doesn't mean we should just sit back and pretend that everything is a bed of roses.

Yes, measures should be taken to ensure that attacks on the scale of those we saw on the WTC cannot happen again, but invading my privacy and plavcing restrictions on my liberty is not the way to counter any threats. Perhaps a more prudent method would be for America to stop rampaging all over the world, acting with impunity and doling out 'justice' wherever it see's fit.

super white
19th October 2001, 13:18
I think passive euthanasia should be made legal but active euthanasia should not.

Especially for Christians. I mean - it's all to do with the sanctity of life isn't it? God gave humans life so only God has the right to take it away. However - if medicine wasn't so far advnced people who receive drugs, or are on life support machines or woteva to keep them alive would not be alive and God would have taken their life already. Therefore - i think passive euthanasia should be legalised - coz if ur being all religious that is going aainst Gods will of keeping someone on this earth longer than they were meant to be.

However, active euthanasia means that the doctors get the chance to play god and should not be allowed.

Spot the one who went to a church school ;)

Even if i hadnt tho (coz i aint actually religious) those would stlil be my views - legalise pasive euthanasia and leave well enough alone with active.