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Discussion in 'Current Affairs' started by johnnyT, Nov 16, 2018.
Why vote leave when you know it's going to be executed by buffons that will **** it up?
And I'm doing the same to the people that voted for them to pull us out of Europe.
Because we want to leave the EU, maybe?
Which is your prerogative.
If you want a car to be towed away would you vote for a 5 year old to do it?
No. I'd ring a breakdown company.
Then why would you vote for incompetence to execute something as important and enormous as Brexit?
Should I have called Ghostbusters?
That would have been preferable.
Brexit has been like arguing on this forum in 2006.
It's full of misdirection, straw men arguments and politicians doing the pot calling the kettle black routine.
I think the reality is a hard brexit will never happen.
That means a soft brexit deal that works for us will never happen because the EU can just say no knowing the only out come will be..... We stay in the eu.
The arguments been twisted into two extreme camps. None of which really was that evident when the vote was going on to the extremes it is now where brexiters are racists idiots and pro eu voters are the snow flake "educated" middle class kids who haven't a clue.
My view was we have never been a part of the EU. We always were a thorn in its side and as a island nation who historically have always had the attitude of we'll do it our own way it was best to leave, make it clear and trade with this world on our own terms. I also believe that as much as the banking sector in London contributes to our GDP and immediate tax benefit for the "rest" of the UK... the rest of the UK don't really benefit. There's been several studies on this and as a proud northerner whilst short term (5-10) years I can see the down side and closing of factories I think the long term prospects are better.
((Quick Note - The car factory closures may have been slightly influenced by brexit but a free trade deal with the EU and Japan will have formed the bulk of that argument. If people think we're xenophobic please go to Japan and understand how they see the world. If they can switch the manufacturing of their cards from here, to Japan. They will)
We all knew about this tribal warfare long ago. We did it twice a week.
In all the brexit madness something that made me smile ....
Theresa May is largely to blame for this, calling a GE two year ago and losing her decent majority has ruined anything getting through parliament.
Part of my reasoning for not voting Leave was exactly that. I didn't want a parliament that's not fit for purpose having more responsibility. Why back Brexit until we got our own house in order? It's all well and good wanting out of the EU but there was never an attainable alternative offered. Just pie in the sky, disinformation and more power and sovereignty to a useless parliament.
The Tories are good at spin but since 2010 in terms of actually formulating policy and taking responsibility, I can't remember a worse decade of governance. The alternative is a completely fractured Labour Party and Diane Abbot as Home Sec. The Tories look finished as an effective party of governance but we're stuck with them. The real change in this country needs to come from within. Blaming the EU for our ills has been a red herring for too long now.
MPs have made it largely clear what they don't want, but have not made it very clear what they do want.
Which is the real problem here and has been all along, too many different people wanting different things.
I also found it odd that the 'no deal' off the table vote was quite close, but the delay vote was not. Also nearly 200 hundred tory MPs voting against the delay, so basically 200 tory MPs who want to throw the country into chaos.
They are and continue to be the cause of this mess, idiots like Mogg and Johnson.
Also pretty sad that both major parties played Politics with the 2nd referendum vote.
With regard the 2nd ref vote, not surprised Labour did that, i think their calls for a 2nd ref were just them trying to be opposition and up their game as they still languish behind the hopeless Tories in the polls.
Both major parties are pro-EU at their cores of power. Both have been trying to blag this for 2 years and both have been caught out. Problem is these clowns will soon be running the show and they don't want to, they've always had EU support as well as blaming the EU for anything and everything from bin collections, to lack of funding to shapes and sizes of bananas. We fell for all this shite, we lapped it up and felt empowered to make a decision because our new breed of MP's care what I think. Well I think we've learned that nothing has changed. The likes of Clarke, Blair and May are invested in the EU therefore want to stay. The likes of Mogg, Farage and Bojo are invested elsewhere. it's about their money, when have any of these people cared what we think? They are as ever, feathering their own nests while we argue the toss about blue passports. It's the great rock n roll swindle only posher and less interesting.
For most MPs (i.e. more than 50%), especially those in a Leave constituency, they can only safely go for a second referendum when it is clear that this is the only way to resolve matters and reach a decision. Unfortunately we're not there yet.
Hopefully, we may be nearer when the May deal is killed with the help of the lunatic fringe next week.
The Parties don't care about individuals, in safe seats a lot of these MP's will be fine, stick the right colour rosette on a lump of dog shit and they will get voted in. All this we will not forget rubbish, come a GE people vote for the main 2 parties like drugged lab mice because they want to be able to proclaim themselves the winner.
This is very sadly true, my current MP has recently been concerning himself with the oh so important problem of motorbike noise on a road probably populated by barely 200 people (its a popular country route for bikers), most them sitting in 5+ bedroom houses, many with electric gates and pools. But apparently a troubling enough problem for him to write a FOUR page letter to all his constituents about it and what he has been doing to solve it. He has literally spent months on this and even brought it up in parliament, its a complete colossal waste of time pandering to handful of rich people, whilst there are plenty of more important issues going on in the area that impact more people, but will that make one jot of difference in the polls? No, all the old fogies will vote for him again because hes the conservative candidate and that is who they vote for.
Some constituencies have barely shifted in like 50 years, most voters seem to not give an actual f*ck about the policies the people they vote for actually have or carry out.
On the opposition benches, maybe, but May would have to be a genius to fake this level of incompetence in order to secretly sabotage Brexit and 6 years as Home Sec proves she's certainly not that. David Davis made a total mess of his brief and he's no Remainer. That's where the problems really started. Boris Johnon and Gove between them had the leadership sewn up and then acted like a couple of kids which let May in as PM, rather than a Brexiteer. The Tory Brexiteers have been a big part of the problem. They wanted out of the EU but had no idea of what came next and what it meant (all too familiar in our politics after the epic catastrophes post-Iraq and Libya post-Saddam/Gadafai as an example).
Few Tory MP's really want to stop Brexit (most of whom have joined Chuka's gang) because they value their jobs more and a vast majority of Tory constituencies are big Leave seats.
Safe seats are the 21st century rotten boroughs.
Meet the new boss.