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Brexit What should happen?

Discussion in 'Current Affairs' started by johnnyT, Nov 16, 2018.

?

What should happen now

  1. Leave with May's deal

    5 vote(s)
    4.5%
  2. 2nd referendum weve changed our mind

    40 vote(s)
    36.4%
  3. Cancel it altogether

    29 vote(s)
    26.4%
  4. No Deal **** the EU and lefty snowflakes

    36 vote(s)
    32.7%
  1. tajjuk

    tajjuk Registered User

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    Pretty much irrelevant if you then don't vote in General Elections.

    It's not democracy when it suits you, if you don't like it go to another country but that is how our democracy has worked for 100 years. You can;t complain that your vote isn't heard and then not vote, that is just dumb.

    One vote doesn't decide generations, its why we have them at least every 5 years so the electorate gets a chance to get rid of crap governments who make bad decisions or don't implement their policies.

    Because surprisingly people can make bad decisions and change their minds.

    I also don't remember vote leave EVER = no deal Brexit. From a recent poll I have seen people would rather see a temporary government to avoid no deal and there is also a clear majority that would stay in the UK over a no deal Brexit, so this notion that people voted in 2016 and we should just leave whatever is complete utter bollocks as clearly people do not feel that way.

    So they are not ignoring the vote of 17.4 million people because 17.4 million people did not vote for a no deal Brexit, most polls show that no deal only has about 1/3 support on average, so in going for a no deal you would basically be ignoring the wishes of around 60 - 65% of the country.

    It is also why the Lib Dems have decided to go this way, they clearly feel that the mood has changed (and it has btw, as every poll for the last two years has shown a remain majority).

    Like it or not but the 2016 poll was essentially an OPINION poll, an opinions are like the weather, they change all the time, so why considering the referendum was not legally binding should the electorate be held to it?

    You can bemoan the parties for not delivering Brexit or MPs voting against it, but that is basically no different to a party not upholding an election promise, if you don't like it, you vote them out next general election. If for example we had a referendum on say universal basic income, I'd reckon you'd get a majority that would back it, and a political party in power might say they would implement it, but they would still have to pay for it and most probably wouldn't be able to. They then fail to deliver on that promise, if you don't like that vote for someone else next election, that is how we hold our elected MPs accountable.

    If you chose not to do that then tough luck, time to shut up, you have no right to complain.
     
  2. CharlieBigPotato

    CharlieBigPotato Charlie wants OUT

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    It was stated ategorically and quite clearly from people on all sides of the argument exactly what leaving the eu would entail. It's beyond all reasonable doubt to attempt to conclude otherwise.

    If you chose not to listen, time to shut up, because there's no point complaining about it now.
     
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  3. Mowgli

    Mowgli Registered User

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    I don't trust The Tories on anything and that includes leaving The EU so i cannot vote for them.
     
  4. StretfordEnd

    StretfordEnd Fools can be kings.
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    It's not democracy if you ignore the largest vote in history, from the largest turnout in history, just because it didn't go your way.

    The referendum was 'once in a generation'. The referendum to join the Common Market was over 40 years ago, we didn't have another one 3 years after it.

    Of course they can, but all the polls suggest they haven't.

    David Cameron didn't seem to think it was a non-binding opinion poll? From his final speech, 21/6/16:

    "So as you take this decision – whether to remain or leave – do think about the hopes and dreams of your children and grandchildren.

    "They know their chances to work, to travel, to build the sort of open and successful society they want to live in, rests on this outcome.

    "And remember: they can’t undo the decision we take.

    "If we vote out, that’s it.

    "It is irreversible.

    "We will leave Europe – for good.

    "And the next generation will have to live with the consequences far longer than the rest of us."

    The full transcript of David Cameron's last-ditch plea for Britain to stay in the EU

    Or from 9/5/16:

    “In 45 days’ time, the British people will go to polling stations across our islands and cast their ballots in the way we have done in this country for generations.

    They will, as usual, weigh up the arguments, reflect on them quietly, discuss them with friends and family, and then, calmly and without fuss, take their decision.

    But this time, their decision will not be for a Parliament, or even two.

    They will decide the destiny of our country, not for 5 years or for 10, but in all probability for decades, perhaps a lifetime.

    This is a decision that is bigger than any individual politician or government."

    David Cameron's speech on the EU referendum: full text | Conservative Home

    You talk like we had some kind of proportional representation rather than a first past the post system, people in a 20,000 majority safe seat have no recourse if they disagree with parliament. People (I know) were already disenchanted with politicians after the expenses scandal 5/6 years earlier, and of course the constant internecine pro/anti Europe tory squabbling that had gone on for decades. Now we have politicians who will ignore a referendum and others who are constantly trying to re-write what was said in 2016.
     
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  5. Jonny Ninja

    Jonny Ninja witty unpredictable talent and natural game

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    And that’s fair enough too mate.
     
  6. MrE

    MrE Registered User

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    Even the Greens won't touch that batshit crazy idea of just revoking Article 50 without a referendum.
     
  7. NorfolkSaddler

    NorfolkSaddler Registered User

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  8. StretfordEnd

    StretfordEnd Fools can be kings.
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    [​IMG]

    Johnson makes even Theresa May look statesman/womanlike.
     
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  9. MrE

    MrE Registered User

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    I really cannot imagine any of his advisors advised against him doing the press conference... seems like a rash and reactionary decision from Johnson himself in response to the protests.

    A really bad look when you're trying to present the image of a strong leader seeking out a deal. Running off from Luxembourg with your tail between your legs.

    At least the petrol is cheap...
     
  10. Bacchus

    Bacchus ストエデ | b a c c h u s w a v e | ンへのパス

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    I think it speaks volumes about the competence of Jo Swinson when even a fellow member of the UK's own Remainer/wokesignalling 'Squad' is distancing herself from one of Swinson's policy proposals. But then it's not like she doesn't have a long track record of being highly competent that I've seen personally. I remember the handover at the start of my year on the national executive of the Lib Dems youth wing starting with a stern warning from the senior party management about being lucky to still exist. This coming two years after the one of which Swinson was a vice-chair of bankrupted it with the most spectacular conference venue booking f***-up I've ever seen to the extent the main party had to step in, bail us out and pay off our remaining debts. Admittedly, while she wasn't the worst offender there (the other two key figures disappeared and have never been heard of again in politics) and still managed to have a career, playing a role in bankrupting a major party's youth wing and leaving it without a budget for several years isn't a great start to a CV in politics and it's not a record she's greatly improved on even later on in government.
     
  11. MrE

    MrE Registered User

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    Looking into the Lib Dems target seats for the next election. 26 of their top 50 target constituencies voted leave in 2016 and 31 of them are Tory held seats.

    It makes you wonder why they went for the policy because it will probably strengthen the resolve of any leave voters whilst turning off any soft remain voters who would go for a second referendum above anything else.

    It feels like a policy aimed at getting their popular vote up but it doesn't feel like it will help them in a lot of those marginals they need to win. They have become a single issue party in the same mould as the Brexit Party and it will limit them when it comes to the actual campaign.

    If the line is going to be "Let's put Brexit behind us"/"Let's stop talking about it"... then it'll ring hollow after 5 weeks knocking on doors talking about Brexit...
     
  12. Mowgli

    Mowgli Registered User

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    Yet their loony leader said she wants to win over 300 seats at the next general election. :roflmao
     
  13. Bacchus

    Bacchus ストエデ | b a c c h u s w a v e | ンへのパス

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    A rare movement you might actually get some unity between Lib Dem and Momentum activists and the Brexity Party's supporters if this wasn't at a private event.



    Joking or not they couldn't have really said it much better, one of the few political figures in this country that genuinely deserves to swing from a lamppost on Westminster Bridge for his warcrimes and ethnic cleansing against the people of Iraq, Libya and the native British population.
     
  14. MrE

    MrE Registered User

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    The latest Lib Dem campaign slogan "homophobes are fine by us, but Blairites can piss off" is a surefire vote winner.
     
  15. NorfolkSaddler

    NorfolkSaddler Registered User

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    And now and another bunch of ignorant know it all's have joined the Unlib Notdemocratic stance of "cancel Brexit".
    Can someone please remind me how the majority that voted in Wales actually voted ?

    Plaid's leader pledges to ditch Brexit in election
     
  16. SJ Mackem

    SJ Mackem Red and White Army!

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    "I've got a brilliant idea. If we say we're gonna cancel Brexit without even having another referendum 17 million remainers will vote for us".

    The Liberal Democrats :roflmao

    With old Stonehenge teeth in charge they're a bigger joke than both the tories and labour, and that's saying something.
     
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  17. smogtilldeath

    smogtilldeath Registered User

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    well, it's not in my opinion. The SNP also have a majority in the uk parliament concerning scottish seats, so surely they now have the right to declare independence? The SNPs main objective is independence from the uk. It's most likely the lib dems will have other policies in this election too, maybe other voters will be enticed to vote for them based off those policies, but don't necessarily want to revoke article 50.
     
  18. TAFKAP

    TAFKAP Where's Adim?
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    The Tories have set their policy out to carry on with Brexit, including no-deal as an option, if elected.

    Labour have said they'd have another referendum.

    For the Lib-Dems to differentiate themselves, they simply had to come down on the other side of the argument. If they offered the same Brexit policy as Labour, there would be little point in them putting candidates up at all.
     
  19. smogtilldeath

    smogtilldeath Registered User

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    what the hell were the hecklers doing so close to the talks by the way? Surely they could have moved them further away so they didn't interfere in the speeches?

    To add a bit of balance to this, there is no point johnson doing a speech if he's just going to be screamed over by hecklers.
     
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  20. MrE

    MrE Registered User

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    You still turn up and do the press conference though. And if people scream over you, you have the chance to act above it and look statesmanlike. To just run off makes you look weak... which is quite a feat in Luxembourg.
     

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