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The Global Coronavirus Pandemic

Discussion in 'Current Affairs' started by Tshabs, Jan 18, 2020.

  1. StretfordEnd

    StretfordEnd Fools can be kings
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    Utter nonsense. Again, have you read Logan's Run? Or Soylent Green? Who will decide who's "nearing the end of their life"? Maybe we should just abandon everyone over 60 to their inevitable demise and stop wasting money on their health, which only delays the inevitable.

    In brief, you claim to follow some kind of meditative way of life, but your actual thoughts seem more aligned with Josef Mengele.

    Anyway, none of this has anything to do with Covid19 . . .
     
    Super_horns and Dirk like this.
  2. LEF

    LEF Censored

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    I don't disagree with any of that.

    You seem to be making out that I don't value the older generations, which isn't the case at all.

    No, we shouldn't 'kill off' anyone. That is morally and spiritually repugnant.

    I'm talking specifically about certain reactions/decisions made regarding covid such as locking down the country, which I think has/will have a very negative outcome for those still in their developing years.

    What do you mean 'who will decide who's nearing the end of their life?' It's clear you have missed the point entirely.

    I was talking about covid policy such as locking down the country, supposedly to protect the most vulnerable, at the expense of the younger generations.
     
  3. Super_horns

    Super_horns WATFORD Till I Die
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    Fair enough - I don't think it will happen again unless we really are back at square one.

    And yes the lock down did affect many people in all sorts of different ways I accept - not just health wise.
     
  4. TLC

    TLC FF's OverWench
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    But not trying as hard to save them is perfectly acceptable because as you have repeatedly said society should have priority is for the young not the older or those with illnesses - YOUR words posted on here MANY times so I do wonder why you think anyone is mistaking your sentiment

    Look you said it again - this time along with your anti lockdown rhetoric ..... once again you insist that protecting the vulnerable should not be done at the expense of the younger peoples ability to get on with their lives

    Yet that cap fits you so well :hmmm
     
  5. LEF

    LEF Censored

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    It's perfectly acceptable to try hard to save them, but not at the expense of others. Perhaps you could answer the question I posed earlier:

    if locking down the country for an extended period of time prolongs the life of some already nearing the end of their life, but has a devastating financial, mental and developmental effect on the younger generations, and those to come, is that a positive result?

    I never said 'ability to get on with their lives'. This is where you're trying to misrepresent my opinion.

    It's their mental, physical, emotional, psychological and spiritual development that ought to be prioritized, at least from a societal perspective. I dread to think of the consequences facing the young children of today, being kept at home, prevented from having contact with others, growing up seeing masked people everywhere they go etc. It's not the makings of a healthy society in the years to come.

    The elderly/vulnerable meanwhile should absolutely take precautions and do what they can to boost their immune system and stay healthy.
     
  6. SamB_SCFC

    SamB_SCFC FF Old Skool

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    The new variant has been detected in Belgium. Shit could be about to hit the fan.
     
  7. StretfordEnd

    StretfordEnd Fools can be kings
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    You first.

     
  8. LEF

    LEF Censored

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    No, I haven't had the pleasure of reading those books yet, but I'll make a mental note to do so at some point.
     
  9. TLC

    TLC FF's OverWench
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    And I'm sure dead parents, grandparents, siblings and friends because they died of covid has absolutely no reflection on their mental health at all ...

    What about the mental health of people who are vulnerable - those forced to live locked down already for nearly 2 years with no end in sight ? Where do they fit into your societal model because in your 'young peoples utopia' if they break it's irrelevant?

    As for your question ...... I answered that referencing ALL the vulnerable not just older people .... my brothers 14 year old type 1 diabetic daughter falls into that category too and if she can't go out and get on with living in your scenario then its perfectly all right that she continues to have no life at all .......

    The economical and psychological damage will continue until people enjoy their freedoms with responsibility and care for themselves and everyone else and thats the responsibility of those who are out 'living their lives'

    - the vulnerable aren't the ones irresponsibly propagating the continuing spread and deaths from covid ........
     
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  10. LEF

    LEF Censored

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    Thousands of people die every day. When I was young I experienced the loss of my grandparents, which was really tough to go through, but is an inevitable part of life. Again, I'm not stating that these people don't matter, or that these people shouldn't be helped. I'm stating that it is a fact that people get old and die, and that people get sick and die. This has always been the case and always will be the case, and is something every person has to come to terms with at some point.

    I'm not the one proposing lockdowns? I'm arguing against that very idea. The vulnerable ought to do what they feel is best for them and their situation. I know there are elderly people out there utterly depressed as a result of lockdowns taking away their freedom to do the things that gave their life meaning.

    ....so is your answer 'yes' it's a good result, or 'no' it isn't?

    Can you at least see where I'm coming from here?

    So what course of action do you propose?
     
  11. TLC

    TLC FF's OverWench
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    I'll answer this piece in isolation

    Every person who has covid, who has had covid, every person who is walking around giving someone covid are the people who have taken everyones freedom away.

    The Vulnerable have no choice - we have never had a choice

    You say we should chose 'to do what is best for us' covid turned everything and everyone outside their doors into something that had a high chance of being fatal.

    ...... explain to me again why you think it is acceptable that Hide or Risk Dying is an acceptable choice in this ......

    The lockdowns haven't taken our freedoms away from us for anywhere near as long as the 'free people' wandering round having a great time and infecting and killing each other with wild abandon have managed to do.

    You think its just the elderly who are depressed, isolated and lonely? Is your view of the world really that shallow?

    Every single person who feels the fear of being vulnerable, those people are being kept prisoner in their own homes are not doing it because they feel 'they ought to do what's best for them' they have no choice at all because imprisoment has been forced on them by the 'free plague carriers'
     
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  12. LEF

    LEF Censored

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    So what is the answer here?

    There is always a risk of dying whenever we set foot out of the front door. I'm sure the risk of us dying in a traffic accident outweighs the risk of us dying from covid, but that doesn't stop us getting in our cars or on our bikes.

    I get that it sucks to have a compromised immune system in this climate, but I don't see what you think should happen here? There's inherent risk for the vulnerable relating to covid, which again is unfortunate, but it's also unfortunate that the kids growing up today are mentally, financially and in many cases probably physically screwed as a result of what is happening here. These people aren't at risk of covid, but they are being locked away during their developing years, the most critical time in the life.



    So what is the solution, in your mind? More lockdowns?

    Clearly not?

    My whole point has been that the lockdowns are causing this across all ages and demographics, and it's having a terrible effect on the development of the children growing up through this.

    Who are the 'free plague carriers' that you speak of?
     
  13. MrLeeLemon

    MrLeeLemon 50+1

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    Yeah, seems the individual had no prior links to Southern Africa either. She wasn't vaccinated either, the tit. Oh joy.

    It seems strange that it wouldn't have been detected in the UK yet since they do seem to be very good at finding variants here. So maybe it isn't here yet... but if it is in Belgium, it is probably here.
     
  14. TLC

    TLC FF's OverWench
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    That people actually step up take social responsibility for their actions and protect themselves and others

    Irrelevent

    This does NOT give these emotionally vulnerable people the right to automatically supersede the rights of others to live in a world that is safe for them.

    That people behave responsibly and have a social conscience - something anyone who is a decent human being should be capable of doing

    Which is only going to get worse if they have less experienced people who have lived more to look up to and learn from

    Every person who doesn't behave responsibly and make EVERY effort to protect themselves and others - and in that I mean every last one of those who have the 'I'm young and healthy so it won't kill me' mindset who are mosty emotionally immature people who don't seem to give a crap that this isn't getting better because they are the problem not the solution
     
    #21134 TLC, Nov 26, 2021
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2021
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  15. LEF

    LEF Censored

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    Well, I'm all for your solution in an ideal world, but it doesn't seem very realistic unfortunately.

    At least we seem to agree that lockdowns are bad, which was my original point.
     
  16. SamB_SCFC

    SamB_SCFC FF Old Skool

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    In this case, being unvaccinated is probably a positive because the biggest fear from this variant is the potential ability to evade the vaccines. I think it's fair to say it's probably already here if she's caught it somewhere other than southern Africa and she's been in Europe for a couple of weeks. She won't be the only one.

    Could this be behind the big surge in cases in Europe?
     
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  17. StretfordEnd

    StretfordEnd Fools can be kings
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    Nobody wants lockdowns, of course they are bad, but they are also necessary at times when a virus is running rampant through society.
     
  18. MrLeeLemon

    MrLeeLemon 50+1

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    One thing I have noticed is that hospitalisations have taken their sharpest drop follow a fall in cases since post-Euros. Perhaps this is the impact of the booster program meaning we are at least ensuring more numbers aren't needing to go to hospital and perhaps cases are more concentrated with younger age groups?

    I anticipate a rise will happen due to the fact cases have been rising for about a week now, but seems hopeful that the pressure on the NHS will be too high.
     
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  19. StretfordEnd

    StretfordEnd Fools can be kings
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    It may be virus fatigue but I'm not panicking about this new variant, we've heard it all before but then it's turned out that the vaccines are still effective, I'm expecting the same outcome this time too.
     
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  20. MrLeeLemon

    MrLeeLemon 50+1

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    There is little chance this variant will bypass vaccines entirely. Worth noting just how low the vaccine uptake is in Southern African nations. And I believe all the data that does exist is mostly coming out of South Africa...

    Screen Shot 2021-11-26 at 19.19.28.png
     

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