you mean helping Ukraine to defend itself from an inevitable Russian invasion ? the whole point of this war is euromaiden showed Ukrainians wanted closer ties to the eu . Putin didn’t like that because he and his chums seem to believe they have a right to dictate that Ukraine remain in ifs sphere influence . If yanokovich (wasn’t he president of Ukraine at euromaiden?) hadn’t pledged to forge closer ties to the eu in his pledges and through corruption do a complete 180 and make an economic pact with Russia when elected , euromaiden would never have happened . The Ukrainians always wanted eu membership above all else, and it was only the annexation of crimea that made Ukraine believe they needed nato membership too ( unsurprising ) . Russias own actions push its neighbours closer to nato . poland and Ukraine had roughly the same size economy once the ussr collapsed . Polands economy is now roughly 3 times that of Ukraine’s now and a big factor in that is eu membership . Polands rise is probably a big factor in why Ukraine looks west and I do believe in time if it isn’t annexed by Russia , Belarus will go the same way. It is not the wests fault that Russia is crap at soft power . The Russians have created a famine in Ukraine , tried to cover up a massive nuclear disaster in Chernobyl and now waging war on them as a result of their close links . Putin still scratches his head wondering why Ukraine doesn’t like them
No, the cause is the colour revolution courtesy of the US. WTF are you on about The Euromaidan was a CIA led coup, nothing organic about that at all, Putin didn't like it as understandably no major country would appreciate a foreign power causing mischief and chaos in their backyard putting into power somebody hostile and then deciding to shell Russians for years. Imagine the reaction of the US if China caused a revolution in Mexico or Canada and put in somebody that was anti US pro China in power, they'd come down on them like a tonne of bricks. No Poland is richer than Ukraine as they privatised the industry much better instead of just creating a oligarch class with monopolies in each industry Poland privatised so there was competition and also Poland is MUCH less corrupt than Ukraine. Ukraine's lack of wealth post 1991 is purely down to their elite deciding the loot the country instead of build it up.
that last point is utterly hilarious. thats a complete and utter rewrite of political history right there. Reality is Poland entered EU and was flooded with western money and opportunity. that was 2004. the reality is Poland was on a good track from the 1990s after getting shut of the iron curtain but it was a steady track of growth in 2004 their GDP was 255Billion US (source is world bank btw) the eu kick started more rapid growth in every year bar covid and thier gdp is $688bil today. Ukraine by contrast as a firm satellite state of Russia actually had a bad 1990s and a long period of deflation. in 2004 their GDP was $67bil. without the big injection of western fund and grants and such the eu brings means that ukraine's economy grew less and was more subject to the ill winds of 2008 that hammered them and again when RUSSIA invaded and took over crimea in 2014. Their GDP today is again hammered and stands at 160billion dollars approx. The population of poland is less than the population of ukraine. Ukraine has more resources and better markets but has been ball and chained to russia and as its tried to look wests its been slapped down and pillaged. Guess what? Being influenced by russia = encouragement of corruption.. Lack of EU standards corruption. Poland has been forced and been willing to reform to enter the EU and has benefitted hand over fist form doing so. Your blaming of a ukrainian elite is shambolic and you might as well have written "putin supporters" there is not really one solitary state that joined the eu that has not benefitted from it massively. Even Hungary which represents another Russian stooge type set up has benefitted more form being i nthe EU than urkaine, though again their corrupt faux dictator has means their country has been hammered by even the slightest breeze. Blaming countries for the malign influence of Putin and then saying they shoudl bend over for putin and surrender is really hilarious.
Mate, you do realise that you've just proved my own point for me right? Smog said that Ukraine and Poland had roughly the same size economy in 1991, which is correct, and then you said that Poland's GDP was $255b in 2004 BEFORE joining the EU vs Ukraine's $67b economy in 2004 almost 5x lower than Poland's all without EU money... Yes, the elite of any country is responsible for their countries progress and the Ukrainian elite are truly awful, as exemplified by recent events where they've been sending their women to die in trenches. **** them.
nothing to back up your claim it was thre cia other than your far right russian propaganda. Everyone who dislikes the Russians is subject to American propaganda , right ? Maybe nothing to do with the fact Russia historically treats its neighbours like shit . They really haven’t changed from soviet times the Russians . Everything bad in Russia is America’s fault as per , or the west shelling Russians for years ? You mean Russia sending in some of its own army disguised as “separatists “ after euromaiden and claiming Ukrainian territory as Russian and the Ukrainians fighting to get it back from the army Putin sent in ? Do **** off with that assertion , there is absolutely nothing wrong with the Ukrainians fighting to get back what is rightfully theirs and Russia agreed to as the borders when the ussr collapsed of course , it just so happens the former soviet states and satellites that went west have much superior economies now ,ie the baltics and poland . Romania also doing much better too . All those former soviet states desperate to join the eu , but of course Polands rise is because of industrialising further . I mean if it was surely just that, why not do it while a soviet satellite state ? All those countries wanting access to the single market , but of course you know better because Ivan off twitter says that’s the reason Poland is doing well now . You obviously know more than western politicians . Countries like belarus stay stagnant under Russian influence while its neighbours flourish . As demographics change and it’s not forcibly annexed by Russia , it’s only a matter of time with Belarus too If Russia focused on improving the lives economically and human rights wise of its neighbours , most of these nations in its “sphere of influence “ would be happy to stay in them as it could project better soft power . It’s not the wests fault it doesn’t , and still focusses on imperialism
I've posted before that given the amount of Ukrainians who have buggered off to the the west I am surprised there is anyone left there to fight. Bild is now reporting that over 400,000 males of conscription age have run away westwards, 220,000 of them claiming benefits in Germany, rather than defend their own country. Government Ministers here are now calling for benefits to military call up age males to be curbed or stopped.
One at my work got a full time contract after 3 months, 2 months later he went off on sick pay with a sore wrist. That was 3 month's ago. #theydontmakethemliketheyusedto
The sheer brass neck of these people not wanting to fight and die against Putin's invading army, it's almost as if they don't think a tyrant like Putin should hold the power of life and death over them.
Just as well we didn't have that attitude in WW II, then again there was nowhere to run away to. Surely you defend your country ?
there's theories here that the conditions are so good Ukrainians are claiming houses and benefits here then flying out on Ryanair to wherewver and coming back once in a while to claim some more. the eu is a soft touch when optics and politics get involved. all benefits will be totally cut across Europe before long.
Indeed. All trains between Hamburg and Ukraine are booked up for days on end. My Ukrainian neighbour is hardly ever here she is usually back home, most of them are not from war zones. As I said, probably just as well.
tbh we got neighbours who got out of an apartment block here where there was nothing but troubles with all sorts from different countries doing the same stuff. one side calling the cops the second the other side arrives back and such. at work we've loads of great people from all over as well and no trouble so hamding out hige benefits permenantly is the issue at hand . we even a geordie at work lol. they'll let anyone in (more of a rugby type mind you, posh geordies)
